rear trailing arm bushings

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rear trailing arm bushings

Postby -LSD- » Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:29 pm

hey guys, have another stupid question.
I really need word of advice. I was driving down the street today, and somehow magicaly my axle just ripped (stripped) out all of the bolts on the flange, started spinning around and hitting everything on the way, braking diff mount/cover. Now im getting new diff and axle, which i can't even find yet. But heres the thing, i decided to pull out subframe, will install solid subframe bushings, but for the trailing arms not sure what to get.
1sr option (akg motorsports) adj rear trailing arm bushings which are 235 bucks
2nd option is non adj bushings with toe/ camber weld in kit (eccentric bolts) which come out to be 255.
So its a really close call. Im not sure how much adjustment i will get with adj bushings. I really need some feedback from someone who has them. I've seen ppl welding in the adj tabs, toe adj is pretty much infinite, and camber depends on how far of center u weld them in. BUT adj bushings on the other hand seems like alot less work...need some help on this asap SMH. Need to get my car back on the road, my only transportation
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby Yoshi » Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:09 pm

eccentric bushings will roll around over time and lose their adjustment. They simply don't work. The weld ins will work for you. Just make sure to get 75D poly trailing arm bushings. It's the only way to go if you want adjustability back there. Sadly, you'll wind up maxing toe out and pos camber no matter what you. Esp with the raised subframe, the only way you'll be able to adjust it anyway is to partially drop the subframe. It's a giant whore no one talks about.
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby -LSD- » Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:23 pm

Yoshi wrote:eccentric bushings will roll around over time and lose their adjustment. They simply don't work. The weld ins will work for you. Just make sure to get 75D poly trailing arm bushings. It's the only way to go if you want adjustability back there. Sadly, you'll wind up maxing toe out and pos camber no matter what you. Esp with the raised subframe, the only way you'll be able to adjust it anyway is to partially drop the subframe. It's a giant whore no one talks about.

thank you so much for fast reply yoshi, you are awesome. So ill order weld in kit and call it a day. 75d is a material? Sorry for noob question, just making sure. This car is sucking all of my money, its crazy
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby Yoshi » Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:43 pm

Here's an article I wrote about poly (75d) http://www.slidewaysonline.com/?q=node/22

Long story short, it's the hardest of the polyurethane and will flex the least under any circumstance.
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby -LSD- » Sat Jun 30, 2012 2:01 am

Yoshi wrote:Here's an article I wrote about poly (75d) http://www.slidewaysonline.com/?q=node/22

Long story short, it's the hardest of the polyurethane and will flex the least under any circumstance.

Nice article man, thanks a lot.
One last stupid question. I was about to order that weld in adj kit, but i was told that IE just came out with a better version (which is obviously more expensive) that "never goes out of adj" and stuff like that.
Did you see it? Or had any experience with this new stuff, and is it really worth buying it over old design?
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby Yoshi » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:42 pm

link me? IE has had a bad rep lately. *shrugs* I'd be weary.
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby -LSD- » Sat Jun 30, 2012 7:55 pm

Yoshi wrote:link me? IE has had a bad rep lately. *shrugs* I'd be weary.

http://www.iemotorsport.com/bmw/E30-sus ... -lock.html
looks interesting, so theres no more eccentric, looks like it might hold better + it would be easier to adjust since u dont have turn the bolt, u can move arm in any place, so as long as u can loosen up the bolt, u r are good to go...mixed feelings...
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby Yoshi » Sat Jun 30, 2012 9:03 pm

eh. the ones I have don't lose adjustment now. I Guess this is insurance. Give it a shot if you want. It looks like it will make in car adjustments harder.
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby -LSD- » Sun Jul 01, 2012 7:10 am

Yoshi wrote:eh. the ones I have don't lose adjustment now. I Guess this is insurance. Give it a shot if you want. It looks like it will make in car adjustments harder.

i guess ill try em out, and ill let you know how it is
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby pr0craztinazn » Sun Jul 01, 2012 9:00 pm

Japanese GT300 class touring cars restricted to factory style suspension setups in the 80s tried this and it still slipped under harsh loads. It theoretically is better, but few people in the E30 world have tried solutions like this.
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby -LSD- » Fri Jul 20, 2012 5:15 am

hey guys, sorry took a while to reply, gathering all the parts and puting them on took 3weeks...

What i got
75d training arm bushing from akg
solid aluminum subframe and diff bushings
ie adj kits for both toe and camber
new wheel bearings and and axle(one was broken already) while i was at it.

Basically doing rear end rebuild if you can call it so.

Let me go by the list
trailing arm bushings. Pulling them out was easy, so as installing. Quality stuff from akg as usual. Heard some ppl had issues with bushing making squeaky noise alot, well akg bushing have grooves inside them, so a little grease...quite so far. Big improvement over stock, obviously. I can recommend them to anybody.

Subframe/diff bushings 12mm raising the subframe
well this where fun begins. Pulling them out was a major pita... I was using pulled, press, torch...non of that worked to well. So i decided to do what i did on my 240 a long time ago when i was installing aluminum bushings as well. I cut 2-3 slots with a sawzall (gotta b gentle here and stop on time, cutting subframe won't be much help in this case) and gently jammed a screwdriver between bushing and subframe to fold the bushing in.
After this they fell out right away. Pressing new bushings in was no problem with a press. Shorter side goes up, obviously to rais a subframe. Same thing was done to a diff cover. Took only 30 min.

Now for the camber/toe adj.
Its gay...cant stress it enough. Welding them in was fairly straight forward, except some places where i couldn't reach with my fat ass mig. Sloting holes took one full day... I was stressing out coz i needed the car to be back on the road (daily driver). I was using dremmel with cutting disks and grinding stone, both worked very well.

Everything was getting ready to back in the car. I assembled subframe and control arms and eyeballed adj on them (which later appeared to be nearly perfect, who needs alignment machine anyways). Trying to instal subframe wasn't easy, clearly aluminum bushings would go in without a fight...two hours fight. While my friends who was "helping" me by sitting on facebook xD i was sweating my ass off trying to get it in.
Two things....If you are installing bushings which raising a subframe by 12mm...be prepared...
1. Camber adj. Will hit the floor board which is not such a big deal, but i weld them as low as possible so if u go higher u will have to hammer some stuff in.
2. Outer plate for toe adj will hit a frame of the car...at this point it was to late to pull the subframe out so i jammed screwdriver in the and metal slightly...it was enough for the subframe to go in.
Installing a diff was a major bust. Even tho i aligned bushing as instructed...it won't align with a hole on the frame bracket...after an hour of sweating and swearing i dropped a diff pulled out the bushing and clocked it about 5-10 degrees clockwise. Everything went in no problem.
Drove the car after assembling the rest (axles, brakes, etc) it was going straight, which really surprised me.
Got it on the alignment rack today...my right toe was little off and both sides camber was -1.8 which i wasn't satisfied with so i dropped it to -1.5. Easy, took me 20 min.
Now for the toe.... -omg-. I think people around me got brain damaged after listening to all i had to say about it -yuush- . First of all its really hard to get to the bolts. Second, you cant see the outer plate as its hidden between subframe and frame of the car, i was using tiny mirror to be able to see where the plate is, so that the teeth on the locking bolt match the teeth on the plate, but its nearly impossible. After two hours of raising up, lowering down and trying to get that plate flat i managed to get toe within acceptable range, and lock it in place correctly, which im not even 100% sure. All this made me think of cutting a little windows under rear seats so i will be able to see wtf is going on behind there. Last thing i want to do is to damage the teeth.
Which brings me to the point...I STRONGLY DO NOT RECOMMEND TO GO WITH NEW DESIGN FOR TOE ADJ. use eccentric bolts (yoshi was right, in car adj is very,very difficult), it will make it 100500 million times easier to adj toe.
I DO recommend to get new design for camber on the other hands, it gives you a wide range of adj. And easy to get it right.

I will add some pics later, once i get to my pc. It this it so far, i apologize for any spelling mistakes, super tired.
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby Yoshi » Fri Jul 20, 2012 12:00 pm

-LSD- wrote:yoshi was right



I remember I used to copy and paste these into my signature. Then it got too long lol.

The non slotted ones didn't require me to bash in the floor area to adjust. But I do partially drop the subframe to make adjustments easier lol. There really is no easy way to do that adjustment.

Did you have any issues with your drive shaft hitting the gas tank saddle? I recommend the diff lowering kit so it's back in stock specs. It's not good to have it up that high.
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby -LSD- » Fri Jul 20, 2012 8:41 pm

i had no doubt you were right, since clearly you have tons of experience in that area, but when i was trying to read up more about this new design, i couldn't find much info so figured ill give it a shot, mb it'll help someone else to decided what they want to go with.
Im not having any issues with driveshaft it looks like there is still plenty of clearance. Do you have a link to this diff lowering kit, im just curious how does it look. On the hand id like to vote against diff lowering kit, since it kinda defies the purpose of raising everythin up. Besides correcting camber, On the lowered cars/SLAMMED especially it'll help to keep axles straight horizontal. I've had experience of braking axles on slammed 240 but after raising subframe never ran into that issue again.
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby Yoshi » Fri Jul 20, 2012 11:26 pm

Lowering your diff 12mm will put the axles at an angle again but not by much. But it won't change camber/toe or any of that jazz. It's basically, do you want your drive shaft at an odd angle or your axles? I'd rather axles.
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Re: rear trailing arm bushings

Postby -LSD- » Sat Jul 21, 2012 12:41 am

oh no don't get me wrong i understand it won't change alignment. Just saying, from my experience axles tend to get beat on with a welded diff...and again from my experience they brake before driveshaft...but then again my experience comes from all the 240s i used to have. This is my first e30 so i don't know much about weak spots etc. But if i will brake my driveshaft ill definitely let u know =) so u can copy paste "yoshi was right, again" lol
Alex K.

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